Subframe electronics.
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First of all, we should coin some term for this new kind of devices. Besides "subframe electronics" I really like "solid state electronics", because they don't usually change across frames (the device has to get itself into the original state by the end of the frame).
Also subframe electronics general thread.
Since subframe interactions depend on particle order, you have to make sure that your device's particles are in the same order as they would be after you upload the save. When saving, particles are reordered top to bottom, left to right (stacked particles not reordered). I made a script that does this whenever you want, so you don't have to localsave or stamp the contraption and then load it (note that copy-paste will not work): https://starcatcher.us/scripts/?view=59 (fixed link -- @LBPHacker)Edited 2 times by mniip, LBPHacker. Last: 5th Dec 2021 -
I like the idea of some sort of standard terminology for electronics; that might also make it easier to learn and/or teach electronics to less experienced users.
(this reminds me how long it's been since I've made a save, I should make something)
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Well you and SchmolenDevice are the experts on subframe electronics at the moment. I'm happy calling it that. Would be nice to see a formal tutorial put up in the wiki with all that you and him have learned. I haven't delved into it myself yet. (well I have dealt with plenty of cases where sub-frame timing was important, but I haven't tried 1 frame pscn yet).
Edited once by Synergy. Last: 16th Apr 2015 -
A3SFTT!!! Sorry for the excitement, but yeah at one point I suggested Advanced Solid Spark Sub-Frame Timing Technology, or A3SFTT/'aes-fet' which sounds like MOSFET (metal-oxide semiconductor field effect transistor). Just as MOSFET and CMOS logic families were ground breaking in speed and size in the real world electronics industry, so can A3SFTT to the Powder Toy electronics industry. Oh and nice having the mod for auto updating particle IDs. And yeah, a number of new electronics and 'PSTN animation' stuff have been coming up on FP on the occassion. "'Tis a new era!"
@Synergy I'm thinking of eventually setting up my own standard for A3SFTT electronics technical documents. One of the 'books' would be a compendium of all A3SFTT technology we have accumulated on TPT throughout the 'years' starting from all basic to advanced methodology. Another book would be for all invented A3SFTT devices and computational standards/form factors.
It would indeed be quite nice to have an organized system for documenting 'modern' TPT technologies.
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@Synergy (View Post)
I wouldn't exclude the other 2 people who seem capable of understanding it: @FuriousWeasel and @jacksonmj -
I would welcome a wiki article on said "subframe electronics" - the current wiki is a bit behind in all the newfangled technology, and an introduction to said fancier electronics would both be beneficial as a reference to current implementers and an insight into a new technology for new adopters. However, I don't really know how said electronics work... :D
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Subframe electronics. I'm no expert and in fact im so out of my zone I have no idea what you are talking about, but if things are becoming more advanced, we should try to keep the wiki up to date. I know most of my knowledge has come from there, from PSTN usage to even basic stuff like breaking points for GLAS. If we want to be able to have a whole host of innovative people making magnificent saves, we need an up to date, easy to understand wiki, so that when people like me come along late to the party we can come up to speed quickly, and maybe pump out something awesome too. Just sayin.
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I'll start with the explanation of solid sparks.
As we all know (those of us who have read the source anyway), the frame update process can be simplified to the following:- Life decrement on all particles
- Particle updates, in ID order (which in a loaded save goes top-to-bottom and then left-to-right)
Any good particle (for example ARAY), when checking for adjacent SPRK will also check whether its life is 3, but BTRY sets the life to 4! So the life decrement should happen between the BTRY update and the ARAY update. Also, BTRY only charges metals with life=0, so after ARAY has updated, we need to reset the SPRK(metal) back to metal, this is what we use CONV(metal) for.
Now we have arranged the sequence in which the events should happen:- BTRY update (charge)
- Life decrement
- ARAY update
- CONV update (discharge)
Note that the metal's own update doesn't matter much. Now, life decrement happens before any particle updates, so that's where the frame starts. The particles should update in the order of: ARAY->CONV->BTRY. There isn't a whole lot of ways to arrange the 4 particles like that, for example:
Edited 2 times by mniip. Last: 18th Apr 2015 -
@mniip (View Post)
cool tutorial :).
Also ... I understand subframe interactions / electronics too >:, I made this over two years ago:1007090View Save 1007090
